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View Full Version : My Final Cylon Theory & Humanity's Fate


sarah_09irish
August 18th, 2008, 10:45 AM
In "Battlestar Galactica: Razor" the hybrid is heard saying, "And then they will join the promised land, gathered on the wings of an angel. Not an end, but a beginning." Later, the same hybrid says to Kendra Shaw, "Kara Thrace will lead the human race to its end. She is the herald of the apocalypse, the harbinger of Death. They must not follow her. All this has happened before and all of it will happen again, again, again..." I will have to brush up on my religious studies on this one, but I believe that in the Jewish religion the "promised land" is not necessarily a physical place. Rather, a paradise or heaven. If my understanding is correct and it is indeed what the writers of the show are trying to portray, then humanity's future doesn't look too bright. The hybrid never explained how the human race will end. Therefore, there's still much to consider when discussing what could happen; all of the humans die while living on Earth (if the planet they found is actually Earth) or the humans and cylons will breed together (as we've already witnessed this being possible) and over time there will no longer be any "humans" so to speak. My personal opinion is that the second outcome is most likely. Especially since the hybrid said this about the end of humanity; "Not an end, but a beginning."
In another one of my posts, I claimed that I thought Tom Zarek would be the Final Cylon, and to be completely honest, I still think so. Regardless, let's put that notion aside for now and discuss this using facts and logic.

Facts & Logic:

1.) Mark Stern said the revelation of the Final Cylon will be "organic and satisfying. It won't be some day player from Season 1." (TV Guide) If my understanding of this is correct, then it will be a character who has been quite significant throughout the whole series so far.

2.) According to Ron Moore, the Final Cylon is not someone in the Last Supper photo. (Ron Moore Chicago Tribune Interview "http://featuresblogs.chicagotribune.com/entertainment_tv/2008/04/ron-moore-on-ba.html") Therefore, this leaves out Laura Roslin, Lee Adama, Gaius Baltar, Starbuck, Karl "Helo" Agathon, and Admiral Adama.

3.) The hybrid from "BSG: Razor" said, "And the fifth, still in shadow, will claw toward the light, hungering for redemption that will only come in the howl of terrible suffering." What is obvious with this quote is that the final cylon will ask for forgiveness for a past sin(s) and hunger for redemption that will come through suffering of some sort. I'm not exactly sure what the hybrid is pertaining to when saying that the fifth is "still in shadow". It could mean a multitude of things depending upon your perception.

4.) In the "MediaBLVD Magazine" Aaron Douglas claims the Final Five are completely different from the other seven humanoid models. The press article also claims that the Final Five are immortal and fit with the mantra "All of this has happened before and it will happen again."


5.) The Final 5 know the way to Earth.



Before we go further, let me ask you this question: What are some of the things the Final 4 have in common?



6.) The fifth cylon, as I see it, should be somebody who was/is a leader or is/was in a high ranking position. Take for instance the Final 4;

1.) Colonel Saul Tigh is second in command to Admiral Adama.
2.) Tory is the secretary to President Roslin.
3.) Chief Tyrol led the Union on New Caprica.
4.) Samuel T. Anders led a Guerilla War Resistence group after the attack on Caprica.

7.) All of the four of the Final Five were left behind, held captive and/or tortured on New Caprica.

8.) Now, I'm not sure on this one; but I've suspected that the Final Cylon should also still be alive, and has been throughout the series so far. My reasoning behind this is because one of the Eights said, "They're in the fleet with the humans." I know very well that this could mean that the final cylon is somebody they have known to be human because he/she was in the human fleet. However, it could also mean that the Final Cylon is still alive or it could mean both situations.


Characters I See as Possibilities: Tom Zarek, Felix Gaeta, Doctor Cottle, and Anastasia Dualla

genji2000
August 18th, 2008, 10:57 AM
Hey Sarah. Any chance you could use the same font and font size throughout so your posts are easier to read? The default font is preferable.

Also - you didn't go back to your other recent thread about Roslin to take up that debate. Are you intending to abandon this thread too?

Osprey
August 18th, 2008, 11:01 AM
for the bajillionth time, how do you square any/all of those potential 4 with the now-infamous "4 in the fleet" comment by d'anna, since all of them, were, um, IN THE FLEET?!

also, re: "The Final 5 know the way to Earth." it was starbuck who realized what the signal meant; all the f4 could offer, in the words of tigh, "it's a long shot but it's the best we've got"

/please note -- i'm not trying to attack you or the post, i just am seeing the same old set of arguments that don't presently have an answer ...

sarah_09irish
August 18th, 2008, 11:44 AM
you didn't go back to your other recent thread about Roslin to take up that debate. Are you intending to abandon this thread too?

Of course not! When I have more to say pertaining to that particular thread, I will reply to it.

Pnutmaster
August 18th, 2008, 12:28 PM
4.) In the "MediaBLVD Magazine" Aaron Douglas claims the Final Five are completely different from the other seven humanoid models. The press article also claims that the Final Five are immortal and fit with the mantra "All of this has happened before and it will happen again."

Wha...wha...wait. Must have a link or scan from the article. If they're immortal, well, that puts things into frame.

EDIT: Found the source.

http://www.mediablvd.com/magazine/the_news/scifi/aaron_douglas,_the_human_side_of_battlestar_galact ica_20070629632.html

...Why has nobody mentioned this until now? lol

genji2000
August 18th, 2008, 03:30 PM
If they're immortal, well, that puts things into frame.

I'd be careful with the immortality thing. If they (the magazine) interpreted Douglas' reference to the Final Five as "Cylon gods" in June 2007 to mean 'immortal' it doesn't mean it's so. Immortal in what way? Like TLotR's elves, who can die in combat but are impervious to disease and old age? Or like the Significant Seven, who can resurrect as a result of technology, as long as they're in range of a resurrection facility? If the latter, where's the Final Five facility (on Earth?) and when they're not in range can they really be considered 'immortal'? Immortality is a big concept to introduce in the final ten episodes.

The actors are not best placed to understand where their characters are going in future episodes, and we know enough about Cylons to know that they have only one god. I think Douglas' words should be interpreted as 'revered Cylons' and possibly the five priests, rather than taking his "Cylon gods" at face value. All we really know about the Final Five is that they're "fundamentally different" to the Significant Seven. More realistic, I think, is Douglas' statement that the Final Five "are the originals", which I find just as difficult to swallow as them being "fundamentally different."

Of course not! When I have more to say pertaining to that particular thread, I will reply to it.

Glad to hear it. So what do you say to Osprey's point that all of your possible candidates were in the fleet when D'Anna said the Fifth wasn't?

Can I just point out again that 'redemption' is not the same thing as being forgiven? Redemption is more like salvation - being released from the shadows, not being forgiven for some past sin or crime.

Pnutmaster
August 19th, 2008, 12:36 AM
You bring some sense to my paranoia, genji. I'm interpreting words as they fit greater theories in mind.

I too disregard the "Cylon Gods" comment, but I can't help feel Douglass wouldn't call them "immortal" unless they were "immortal" in a way "fundamentally different" from the Significant Seven.

genji2000
August 19th, 2008, 02:07 AM
You bring some sense to my paranoia, genji. I'm interpreting words as they fit greater theories in mind.

I too disregard the "Cylon Gods" comment, but I can't help feel Douglass wouldn't call them "immortal" unless they were "immortal" in a way "fundamentally different" from the Significant Seven.

Douglas didn't call them immortal, did he? I thought that was the magazine's spin on his "Cylon gods" comment.

Pnutmaster
August 19th, 2008, 11:53 AM
Douglas didn't call them immortal, did he? I thought that was the magazine's spin on his "Cylon gods" comment.

I tried accessing the source last night, but it was down (hmmm). I'll post his exact words as soon as they become available again.

EDIT: Gah, damn embellishments. Aaron Douglass only says, "The final 4or5. We are the gods, we are the originals."

So much for having stumbled upon a vital clue :p

genji2000
August 19th, 2008, 12:01 PM
Interesting. The site is back up now and that article totally fails to support Sarah's statement that "the press article also claims that the Final Five are immortal and fit with the mantra 'All of this has happened before and it will happen again.'" Maybe she was referring to a different article. "Immortal" isn't mentioned in it as far as I can see.

Wouter
August 19th, 2008, 03:23 PM
Indeed, none of this is in the actual article. It would also be strange, considering what Jamie Bamber said about spiritualism in the show - that by the end, those who wanted to see a higher power would be able to see it and that those who wanted to reason it all out without a higher power would also be able to do that (he himself apparently being in the latter group, at least that was my impression).

The 4 or 5 (interesting, by the way, that Aaron apparently wasn't quite sure whether or not to include the 5th - a special case, it seems) being the "originals" looks more likely; I suspect they come from the 13th tribe (as in, they were either made by that tribe or they were outright members of it) and they may have been the template for the 7 - and likewise for their technology (the hub?). Speculation, of course, but it wouldn't surprise me if at least their origin is a looong time ago.

Pnutmaster
August 19th, 2008, 05:15 PM
Indeed, none of this is in the actual article. It would also be strange, considering what Jamie Bamber said about spiritualism in the show - that by the end, those who wanted to see a higher power would be able to see it and that those who wanted to reason it all out without a higher power would also be able to do that (he himself apparently being in the latter group, at least that was my impression).


A much needed reminder, and an understandable one.

Still, I demand an explanation of the Head characters :p!