Cylons / Replicants

[Adasel]

Hi all.
I'm pretty new to the forums and would first like to say a big hello to everyone!!.
Okay, so I have just watched Blade Runner (again) and I cant help but notice the similarities behind the new re-imagined cylons and the Replicants in the classic 80s movie.
I wonder if Moore was basing his idea on this or if its just pure coincidence.
Please, share your ideas!.

p.s - can someone tell the forum moderators to get rid of the title "fanwanking" as its totally gross and probably puts off hundreds of potential new members from joining!.

[genji2000]

Hello there. Yes I think there are similarities between the Cylons and Replicants, as there are between the Cylons and the agents in The Matrix and the robots in I, Robot. It's the classic Frankenstein tale of the genius' creation turning against its maker.

p.s. - from a mod: the word is a generally accepted term to describe... well, the definition is here (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Fanwank). It's not specific to this site. Fanonanism doesn't have the same jolly ring to it. Personally I object more to the forum's spelling of 'theorising'.

[Joe Beaudoin Jr.]

p.s. - from a mod: the word is a generally accepted term to describe... well, the definition is here (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Fanwank). It's not specific to this site. Fanonanism doesn't have the same jolly ring to it. Personally I object more to the forum's spelling of 'theorising'.

It. Is. Spelled. With. A. Z. :prrr:

[genji2000]

Classic.

A 'zed', you say? How 17th century.

[pagad]

To be honest I always get thoroughly confused as to which country spells things with "s's" and which spells them with "z's".

[Pnutmaster]

English needs no z's! Then again, neither does it need to spell "honor" like the French ;)

[Adasel]

genji2000, no disrespect, but i was challenging the differences between the Cylons and the replicants, not the agents in the matrix or the robots in AI.
I was merely wondering if Moore might have noticed the similarity, as the Replicants seem to have been the more original idea, being compared to the robots in AI or the agents in the matrix :P

[Joe Beaudoin Jr.]

Moore and company drew a lot from Blade Runner, they've basically admitted to such in interviews.

So, yes, Replicants and Cylons are cut from the same cloth.

[Neakal]

Doesn't Helo even refer to Humanoid Cylons as replicants around Colonial Day? Plus several terms like skinjobs also came from Blade Runner afaik. So terminology aside they were probably aware that they had some common points with Blade Runner.

[The Dirt]

I'm pretty sure that Ron D(eckard) Moore was thinking of Blade Runner when he wrote the miniseries. He make it pretty clear that he was thinking of Edward James Olmos for the role of Adama because of his role in the movie. He was also thinking of Mary when he saw her in Donnie Darko. In that movie, Donnie is "haunted" by a giant time-travelling bunny -- correction: man in a bunny outfit. *spoiler alert* Donnie ends up shooting the bunny's great grandfather in the eye. Which eye, you may ask? 'Why don't you ask Tigh when he was imagining shooting Adama in He That Believeth In Me.

Note: watch for falling plane debris in season 4.5

[Osprey]

"watch for falling plane debris in season 4.5"

/rimshot

[Adasel]

Wow, suprising how many ideas are taken from other movies. Am especially suprised about the Donnie Darko reference. Still havent seen it yet, even though ive had it on DVD for over a month now!.
Mr Joe Beaudoin, thankyou for pointing out my simple, one letter spelling mistake, even though the forum is using the "z" incorrectly in accordance with the Oxford English Dictionary....
Your probably going to respond with, "But i'm American, not english" :p

[Mingus]

Older English used z, then changed to s due to French influence. The US Philological Society around the turn of the 19-20th centuries decided to go back to the original z (because the suffixes in question, such as ization, izing, etc., are Greek in origin, and the Greek used z). So American English, technically, is more original in its spelling, while British English would be considered a modern "bastardiZation" of pure English. From a certain point of view.

This is relevant to this thread because, well, it was talked about here, and Greek mythology is an important aspect of this site. Spelling and all.

Off topic definitely though, I watched a few episodes from a show called "The L Word." There are TONS of BSG cast in it. Cally, Tyrol, Tigh, Tory, Helo, and probably others I haven't seen yet. Check it out!

Oh, and the French for "honor" is not "honour" but "honneur."

[genji2000]

...So American English, technically, is more original in its spelling...

Hence my '17th century' comment. :)

[Adasel]

LMAO Mingus, Bush is a clyon!!.
I knew there was always something about that guy but couldnt quite put my finger on it!!.
By the way, thanks for the history lesson on the use of the enlgish language, although I cant see how the "british" use of it is more modern considering the american colonies origniated form britain in the first place?.

[Mingus]

British English has changed, American hasn't. Just like Canadian French is more "old-fashioned" than Continental French.

[Adasel]

Thanks for the lesson. I guess as nations weve just all gone our seperate ways.
Speaking of history, did anyone else pick up on the similarities between the 13 colonies of man in BSG and the 13 colonies fighting against us british??.
Everyone seems to have it in for us, even Baltar the enemy is a fellow brit. Of course who can forget Mel Gibsons awfully wrong portayal of us in the Patriot??.

[The Dirt]

Regarding language: same thing goes for Spanish (someone that's a native Spanish speaker back me up here). The Colombians consider that their form of Spanish is more "correct". After the Conquistadors invaded America, the Spanish and Dutch crowns had merged in a wedding and the new King was Dutch. He had a terrible lisp and pronounced his Zs like THs. He was also a bit of a despot and he basically forced his lisp upon the Spanish nobility. The Spanish colonies, on the other hands, were far out of his reach, and they maintained the original pronunciations (esp. in Colombia).

Regarding the Donnie Darko reference -- personally, I think that is a coincidence and the writers of BSG did not deliberately make that a Donnie Darko reference. RDM does say that there is a significance in the right eye (Anders red eye moment, Tigh's plucked eye, and shooting Adama), but I have no idea what it is.

[pagad]

Thanks for the lesson. I guess as nations weve just all gone our seperate ways.
Speaking of history, did anyone else pick up on the similarities between the 13 colonies of man in BSG and the 13 colonies fighting against us british??.
Everyone seems to have it in for us, even Baltar the enemy is a fellow brit. Of course who can forget Mel Gibsons awfully wrong portayal of us in the Patriot??.

The reason for this is quite simple: we do the best bad guys.

Forget Mel Gibson, he seems to have it in for us, what with all his horrendously inaccurate "history" films.

[genji2000]

The reason for this is quite simple: we do the best bad guys.

Forget Mel Gibson, he seems to have it in for us, what with all his horrendously inaccurate "history" films.

What - you don't think shagging the queen of England and getting her pregnant, thus ensuring that the entire line of the British royal family is in fact descended from William Wallace, was historically accurate?

[Adasel]

I guess Mel Gibson isnt the most reliable source of historical information :lol:

[genji2000]

There's a statue (a relief actually) of him at the base of the Wallace monument in Stirling. It makes you think...

[137th Gebirg]

Thanks for the lesson. I guess as nations weve just all gone our seperate ways.
Speaking of history, did anyone else pick up on the similarities between the 13 colonies of man in BSG and the 13 colonies fighting against us british??.
Everyone seems to have it in for us, even Baltar the enemy is a fellow brit. Of course who can forget Mel Gibsons awfully wrong portayal of us in the Patriot??.

That was actually something taken from the Original Series where the Colonies were analogous to the 13 Tribes of Israel in ancient times, where the 13th tribe disappeared somewhere along the way. IIRC, the Mormon faith (Glen Larson is a Mormon) believes that the Native American Indians are the lost 13th Tribe of Israel, which is why they were said to have had the Golden Tablets delivered to them by Jesus after his resurrection. These Golden Tablets were why Smith and his crew went out west to Utah and founded the Church of Latter Day Saints upon the discovery of the tablets, which later mysteriously disappeared.

I think the similarities to the 13 Colonies of America are more coincidental in that regard.

[Adasel]

LOL genji, there is a relief of Mel Gibson somewhere in the world??
I hope they dont have him at Maddam Tussauds, that would really make him feel proud of himself :-((
Your right, certainly does make you wonder though.
Thanks for the insight on the matter of the american indians.
As far as history goes, didnt a tribe of native americans suddenly dissapear in the middle of the night??.
I am sure there is a reference to this in an x-files ep.
Sorry if i sounded like im straying of the main subject a little but im not, honest!.

[137th Gebirg]

^^^ That's the Anasazi (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anasazi) you're thinking of. Don't know if it's supposed to be a related issue, but something that certainly makes one wonder what went on in those days. And yes, there was an X-Files episode (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anasazi_%28The_X-Files%29) about it.

Also, check out the Nazca Lines (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazca_Lines) in Peru. They're huge airstrips and designs etched in the earth that can be seen only from the air and space - made thousands of years before the first airplane flew. IIRC, it's one of the main bits of evidence in Van Daniken's (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erich_von_D%C3%A4niken) "Chariots of the Gods (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chariots_of_the_Gods)" that gave Larson his inspiration for the original series.

[genji2000]

^^^ That's the Anasazi (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anasazi) you're thinking of. Don't know if it's supposed to be a related issue, but something that certainly makes one wonder what went on in those days. And yes, there was an X-Files episode (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anasazi_%28The_X-Files%29) about it.

Also, check out the Nazca Lines (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazca_Lines) in Peru. They're huge airstrips and designs etched in the earth that can be seen only from the air and space - made thousands of years before the first airplane flew. IIRC, it's one of the main bits of evidence in Van Daniken's (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erich_von_D%C3%A4niken) "Chariots of the Gods (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chariots_of_the_Gods)" that gave Larson his inspiration for the original series.

Where do you get this stuff? Are you actually the computer that comes up with the answers when I type something into Google?

[Adasel]

omg genji, we've been speaking to the Google operator all this time!!!.
Thanks for the info and the links Gebirg.
The book Fingerprints of the gods also touches on similar subject matters and is a recommended read.
The X-files episode basically touches upon the fact that they were abucted by aliens, or were aliens.
Such a pity the show got its head stuck up its own arse though, it had so much promise and I pray to the gods that BSG doesnt fall into the same trap!.

[genji2000]

lol. He certainly makes me feel less of a geek!

[137th Gebirg]

:D Heh...You're welcome all. Actually, this stuff has been a hobby of mine for many years now, and I have done a bit of research on my own. My love for all things Battlestar ties directly into this other stuff. You all just happened to stumble across it in one of your threads. If I don't know the answer, I will most likely know where to find it.

[pagad]

There's a statue (a relief actually) of him at the base of the Wallace monument in Stirling. It makes you think...

a) Why is there a monument to William Wallace in the first place?

b) What?

c) Hilariously, Wiki sez that the statue was vandalised so much it had to be put inside a cage! Hee hee.

Anyway, yes. Off topic.

These Golden Tablets were why Smith and his crew went out west to Utah and founded the Church of Latter Day Saints upon the discovery of the tablets, which later mysteriously disappeared.

That sort of thing seems to happen a lot.

[genji2000]

a) Why is there a monument to William Wallace in the first place?

Well, it's not like it's in the middle of Iver Heath or something. It's quite an impressive monument. Glad the Mel Gibson thing's been removed though. It was a bit stupid to be honest.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/e/e9/William_Wallace_Statue.JPG/200px-William_Wallace_Statue.JPG

And crap.

Freedom!

[Adasel]

Okay now im really confused....
Is this supposed to be William Wallace or Gibson AS wallace?
It does bare an uncanny resemblance to the anti brit/anti-semetic aussy actor.
Bet you can guess i'm not too fond of the guy

[pagad]

Bet you can guess i'm not too fond of the guy

Join most of the rest of the world.

Although, to be fair, we wouldn't have had that Family Guy parody of him without him. Oh Mel you crazy man.

[BSGfan-atic]

Back to the Cylon/Replicant thing. It is interesting to note that in the original Philip K. Dick short story, "Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep," which was the basis for the monumental Blade Runner, that there is a strong religious overtone running through it, just as there are theological overtones in BSG. In the short story though, the replicants were IMHO nowhere near as interesting as either the replicants in Blade Runner, or the Cylons in BSG. Also in the short story, for those of who haven't read it, animals and the environment were wound up in the religious aspect. It makes me think of Six and her projected forests. Three, with her projected churches, is also kind of similar. Then there is Baltar, and his totally off the wall projections of Six... not at ALL religious. LOL.

[Adasel]

OMG BSG-fan I had totally forgotten about the projection aspect of cylons!.
Doesnt it seem odd that cylons, a descent of mankinds creation, would have an almost religious ability like this?.
This will almost definately play a part in the last set of season 4, unless of course Ron Moore and crew just write off that storyline all together.

[Mingus]

"Off topic definitely though, I watched a few episodes from a show called "The L Word." There are TONS of BSG cast in it. Cally, Tyrol, Tigh, Tory, Helo, and probably others I haven't seen yet. Check it out!"

I've watched more, and Tigh (Mike Hogan) and his real-life wife, also known as Captain Franks in Crossroads, are in the show. As are Maya, Hera's adoptive mother. She plays a vampire lesbian. Just if anyone's interested.

It really looks like they borrowed the whole cast. Both shows were mainly started at the same time.

[genji2000]

"Off topic definitely though, I watched a few episodes from a show called "The L Word." There are TONS of BSG cast in it. Cally, Tyrol, Tigh, Tory, Helo, and probably others I haven't seen yet. Check it out!"

I've watched more, and Tigh (Mike Hogan) and his real-life wife, also known as Captain Franks in Crossroads, are in the show. As are Maya, Hera's adoptive mother. She plays a vampire lesbian. Just if anyone's interested.

It really looks like they borrowed the whole cast. Both shows were mainly started at the same time.

Is the show itself any good though? What's it aboot?

[zulu9812]

There's a statue (a relief actually) of him at the base of the Wallace monument in Stirling. It makes you think...

You're from Stirling? Small world!

[genji2000]

You're from Stirling? Small world!

I've been to Stirling.

[Mingus]

Funny you should be listed as the Athens of the North. The city I live in, Tartu, is called the Athens of the Emajõgi (the river that runs through it). A bit embarrassing really, as it's the only city on that river anyhow. You could also say it's the Battlestar of the Emajõgi, for all that it has in common with Athens.

Anyhow, the L Word, is a tastefully (if not often cheesy) story about a group of lesbian friends in LA. Lesbian Sex and the City really, but with B-actors and writers. Worth the watch though. Put on by Showtime, and great if you want to see Tory the Cylon hitting on a woman, or Tigh with a lesbian daughter/tennis star, or Maya as a vampire lesbian topless. The emotions are pretty real though...there's definitely a lot of real substance for the mature viewer.

[genji2000]

It doesn't sound bad and I'd fancy watching a show with a ton of BSG cast in it, but I'm not sure I can empathise with the plight of the average lesbian. Average Cylon, yes. Lesbians? Not so sure.

[pagad]

...I'm not sure I can empathise with the plight of the average lesbian. Average Cylon, yes. Lesbians? Not so sure.

Driven from their homeland and under threat of being completely wiped out, most lesbians face a desperate existence in appalling conditions.

[Neakal]

Driven from their homeland and under threat of being completely wiped out, most lesbians face a desperate existence in appalling conditions.

That probably holds a literal truth in some places.

[Pnutmaster]

It doesn't sound bad and I'd fancy watching a show with a ton of BSG cast in it, but I'm not sure I can empathise with the plight of the average lesbian. Average Cylon, yes. Lesbians? Not so sure.

How about an average lesbian Cylon Number 8? Alas, no Grace Park (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0661825/) in this show.

[Mingus]

So now Callum or whatever, the guy who plays Leoben the Cylon, is in the show too. Plays the boyfriend of a woman who seduces a rich lesbian to extort her. And this is only Season 3!!!

[Mingus]

And the priestess who died on Kobol and came back in the president's head in season 4? She ironically plays a Jamaican nurse taking care of a woman dying of breast cancer.