Things I think about

[Proxenus]

A few things, in my opinion, need to be focused upon before we continue the analysis of the BSG story.

As I understand it, humanity lived on Kobol for a significant amount of time. It is believed by the Colonials that Kobol is humanity’s home world. Approximately 4,000 years ago, a group known as the thirteenth tribe leaves Kobol and travels to Earth. Approximately 2,000 years ago, the remaining twelve tribes leave Kobol in a “galleon” for the twelve planets.

Some remaining members of the thirteen tribes remain on Kobol rather than leave on the Galleon and take the “high road” that leads to Athena’s Tomb. Their ultimate fate is unknown, but it is assumed they died in Athena’s Tomb or on the way there.

Things to consider.

1. The inhabitants of Kobol had interstellar travel at leave 2,000 years before the BSG events and possibly 4,000 years ago. We know this because the “galleon” was able to travel interstellar. It is likely that the “galleon” was not built with the Lords of Kobol permission, given that Athena killed herself because the Twelve Tribes left.
2. The map to Earth in Athena’s tomb is taken from an Earth perspective. This implies one of two possibilities. Either some members of the thirteen tribe returned to Kobol to provide the map or that humanity was from Earth originally and provided a map back to Earth.
3. The Temple of Five is about 4,000 years old, which puts it in line with the Exodus of the Thirteenth Tribe. However, the beacon found at the Lion’s Head Nebula was only 3,000 years old.
4. The Temple of Five revealed the identity of the Final Five Cylons.
As far as we know, no one knows the fate of the Thirteenth Tribe or the fate of the Five.

The conclusion of this is inevitable. The Five Priests who were members of the Thirteen Colony are connected to the Final Five Cylons. Followers of the Five Priests have somehow returned to Kobol and to the Twelve Colonies. The Five Priests (or their followers) were able to influence the Cylons to create humanoid Cylons.

If you think about it, humanoid Cylons make no sense for a mechanical being to create; especially one that mimics the human physiology. A Cylon, a being that is controlled by logic, would have created “super humans,” taking the best of the humans and leaving the worst.

I am unsure what this all means, but it could be significant.

[genji2000]

Weren't the Final Five actually the Five priests? Didn't they set the beacon 3,000 years ago as a marker for them to find their own way back to Earth, having returned to Kobol to configure the map in the Tomb of Athena?

Perhaps the humans can't settle on Earth because of the levels of radioactivity so they pack up and leave it to the Cylons, and head back to Kobol. Gradually the stories they tell to their children and their children's children about the twelve models of Cylon become the myths of the twelve Lords of Kobol.

If they're actually on Earth, that is.

EDIT:

Or could it be that once the humans and Cylons are settled on Earth, the Final Five take Hera, Nicky and the Tigh/Caprica Six child away, back to Kobol, far from the reach of Cavil's cylon fleet.

etc.

[Pnutmaster]

I need two things clarified to make sense of it all.

1) Did human life originally start on Earth or Kobol? My instincts say our civilization was the first. They say that the people of Battlestar Galactica are our descendants. My reason refutes this idea.

Reason asks, how could Greco-Roman polytheism become the dominant religion of our future space-faring descendants? It's too arbitrary. Might as well be Scientology :p What if Greco-Roman polytheism began with The Twelve Lords of Kobol, as did humanity?

Events play out and the Thirteenth Tribe lands on Earth and populates the planet. Greco-Roman polytheism has its time in the early age of human civilization/settlement, but it's forgotten and disregarded by the modern age. Monotheism rises to the top and polytheism flickers in the shadows (in a way, a mirror image of the religious situation on Caprica prior to the Cylons).

((this possibility says that our current civilization is descendant of the 13th Tribe and basically ignores all archaeological evidence we have of Earth's history. However, BSG was originally conceived by a Mormon (plus RDM is/was a Mormon), and don't conservative Mormons adhere to the "Earth is only 4000 years old" spiel? Could have influenced this...))

2) Can this line by "Leoben" be applied to Earth and Kobol?

Each of us plays a role, each time a different role. Maybe the last time I was the interrogator, and you were the prisoner. The players change, the story remains the same.

In other words, do Earth and Kobol alternate in their roles with the revolutions of the Cycle?

[genji2000]

I need two things clarified to make sense of it all.

1) Did human life originally start on Earth or Kobol? My instincts say our civilization was the first. They say that the people of Battlestar Galactica are our descendants. My reason refutes this idea.

Reason asks, how could Greco-Roman polytheism become the dominant religion of our future space-faring descendants? It's too arbitrary. Might as well be Scientology :p What if Greco-Roman polytheism began with The Twelve Lords of Kobol, as did humanity?

Events play out and the Thirteenth Tribe lands on Earth and populates the planet. Greco-Roman polytheism has its time in the early age of human civilization/settlement, but it's forgotten and disregarded by the modern age. Monotheism rises to the top and polytheism flickers in the shadows (in a way, a mirror image of the religious situation on Caprica prior to the Cylons).

2) Can this line by "Leoben" be applied to Earth and Kobol?

Each of us plays a role, each time a different role. Maybe the last time I was the interrogator, and you were the prisoner. The players change, the story remains the same.

In other words, do Earth and Kobol alternate in their roles with the revolutions of the Cycle?

The colonials believe human life began on Kobol.

Graeco-Roman theology is not the religion of the Thirteen Tribes. It's coincidental that they have names like Athena and Apollo for their gods.

I have argued the case for this Earth being renamed Kobol at some point, and Kobol being renamed Earth. Presumably the imminent new cycle would last long enough for the radioactivity on the twelve colonies to die down so that in the next cycle after the imminent one they can be colonised once more.

Or maybe Earth (as of Revelations) is one of the colonies from the last cycle.

If you can work out the Earth-Kobol/Kobol-Earth idea sensibly I'd be interested to hear it. I couldn't.

[Jason1975]

I need two things clarified to make sense of it all.

1) Did human life originally start on Earth or Kobol? My instincts say our civilization was the first. They say that the people of Battlestar Galactica are our descendants. My reason refutes this idea.

Reason asks, how could Greco-Roman polytheism become the dominant religion of our future space-faring descendants? It's too arbitrary. Might as well be Scientology :p What if Greco-Roman polytheism began with The Twelve Lords of Kobol, as did humanity?

Events play out and the Thirteenth Tribe lands on Earth and populates the planet. Greco-Roman polytheism has its time in the early age of human civilization/settlement, but it's forgotten and disregarded by the modern age. Monotheism rises to the top and polytheism flickers in the shadows (in a way, a mirror image of the religious situation on Caprica prior to the Cylons).

((this possibility says that our current civilization is descendant of the 13th Tribe and basically ignores all archaeological evidence we have of Earth's history. However, BSG was originally conceived by a Mormon (plus RDM is/was a Mormon), and don't conservative Mormons adhere to the "Earth is only 4000 years old" spiel? Could have influenced this...))

2) Can this line by "Leoben" be applied to Earth and Kobol?

Each of us plays a role, each time a different role. Maybe the last time I was the interrogator, and you were the prisoner. The players change, the story remains the same.

In other words, do Earth and Kobol alternate in their roles with the revolutions of the Cycle?

That could be possibility and I never really thought about with the planets. However, I had an idea that the final five cylons played the role of Adama, Roslin, Lee, Starbuck, and Baltar in the last cycle.

[genji2000]

That could be possibility and I never really thought about with the planets. However, I had an idea that the final five cylons played the role of Adama, Roslin, Lee, Starbuck, and Baltar in the last cycle.

Interesting idea. Who would be who?

I'd say

Adama = Tigh
Roslin = Tory
Kara = Anders

Not sure which of Lee and Baltar would be played by Tyrol.

[Jason1975]

Interesting idea. Who would be who?

I'd say

Adama = Tigh
Roslin = Tory
Kara = Anders

Not sure which of Lee and Baltar would be played by Tyrol.

actually I was thinking this

Adama=Tigh
Roslin=Tory or the final cylon
Kara=Tory or the final cylon
Lee=Anders
Baltar=Tyrol

[genji2000]

I can see Lee = Anders - that was my first thought, because the Final Five are subordinate to the colonial leaders, and I watched The Eye of Jupiter and Rapture last night, but I opted for Kara = Anders because of their obvious connection. However, if Lee = Anders, then Kara = Tyrol, because he services (or did) her Viper. Which leaves Baltar = Final Cylon, or perhaps Baltar = Baltar?

[Teknopathetik]

Space civilizations taking up Roman gods doesn't seem that arbitrary to me. Our planets are named after roman gods. The constipations (my spell check picked that word and i choose to keep it, i meant *constellations*) have to do with them. Many of our root words come from Latin. if you were adrift in space with no knowledge of religion and you had a bible and a roman theology history book, and you saw the names of all the planets and stars in the history book then which one would you choose?

Roman polytheism is
A. more relevant to a space culture and
B. A far more interesting read

therefor Polytheism would probably win
considering how many purges there have been in this endless loop, it makes sense to me.

[Jason1975]

I can see Lee = Anders - that was my first thought, because the Final Five are subordinate to the colonial leaders, and I watched The Eye of Jupiter and Rapture last night, but I opted for Kara = Anders because of their obvious connection. However, if Lee = Anders, then Kara = Tyrol, because he services (or did) her Viper. Which leaves Baltar = Final Cylon, or perhaps Baltar = Baltar?

The reason for Tyrol = Baltar because their time on Kobol and that Tyrol found Baltar at the temple of five in "Rapture".

I can see Kara = Anders because they are good pyramid players and are now viper pilots.

Well if Baltar is the last cylon then Baltar=Baltar. However, I do not think that Baltar is the last cylon.

[Teknopathetik]

Didn't they say in the temple that the 5 priests worship the one to which they cannot name? Doesn't that imply they work for headguy?

[Jason1975]

Didn't they say in the temple that the 5 priests worship the one to which they cannot name? Doesn't that imply they work for headguy?

Yes They said that 5 priests worshiped the One Whose Name Cannot be Spoken.

Is headguy, headbaltar?

[Pnutmaster]

Graeco-Roman theology is not the religion of the Thirteen Tribes. It's coincidental that they have names like Athena and Apollo for their gods.

Ah, but it is! Remember when Baltar and his followers harassed the polytheists? He mocked them by pointing out that Zeus was a serial rapist and that the birth of Athena bursting out of his head was ridiculous. I think they share more than names...

If you can work out the Earth-Kobol/Kobol-Earth idea sensibly I'd be interested to hear it. I couldn't.If I had it worked out yet I'd be making another post in my dramatically cheesy thread :p

Space civilizations taking up Roman gods doesn't seem that arbitrary to me. Our planets are named after roman gods. The constipations (my spell check picked that word and i choose to keep it, i meant *constellations*) have to do with them. Many of our root words come from Latin. if you were adrift in space with no knowledge of religion and you had a bible and a roman theology history book, and you saw the names of all the planets and stars in the history book then which one would you choose? You make a good point.

Hell, if I was forming a new religion to meet the mythological demands of the day, and I was a space farer, I'd be more than ecstatic to return to polytheism.

Still, to reach that point wouldn't the 13th Tribe need to lose much of its knowledge of Earth before settling on Kobol? If the 13th Tribe was lost in the "desert" of space for 40 years and forgot the details of Earth religion I'd believe this (I avoid the use of 'Terran' because of Terra from the old BSG, hehe).

[genji2000]

The reason for Tyrol = Baltar because their time on Kobol and that Tyrol found Baltar at the temple of five in "Rapture".

OK... I can see that their connections are important in the cycle of time. But...

I can see Kara = Anders because they are good pyramid players and are now viper pilots.

Does that have anything to do with anything? I was thinking more because a) they're married, and b) Anders stayed behind on Caprica causing Kara to go back there.

Well if Baltar is the last cylon then Baltar=Baltar.

That's what I meant.

However, I do not think that Baltar is the last cylon.

Neither do I.

[Jason1975]

OK... I can see that their connections are important in the cycle of time. But...



Does that have anything to do with anything? I was thinking more because a) they're married, and b) Anders stayed behind on Caprica causing Kara to go back there.



That's what I meant.



Neither do I.

It is thought I am toying with so lets go with what you are saying about Kara and Anders.

Kara=Anders
Lee=Tyrol
Adama=Tigh
Roslin=Tory
Baltar=the last cylon

or

Kara=Anders
Lee=Tyrol
Adama=Tigh
Roslin=the last cylon
Baltar=Tory

I like the first one more than the second one.